Saturday 9 July 1664

Up, and at the office all the morning. In the afternoon by coach with Sir J. Minnes to White Hall, and there to a Committee for Fishing; but the first thing was swearing to be true to the Company, and we were all sworne; but a great dispute we had, which, methought, is very ominous to the Company; some, that we should swear to be true to the best of our power, and others to the best of our understanding; and carried in the last, though in that we are the least able to serve the Company, because we would not be obliged to attend the business when we can, but when we list. This consideration did displease me, but it was voted and so went. We did nothing else, but broke up till a Committee of Guinny was set and ended, and then met again for Tangier, and there I did my business about my Lord Peterborough’s order and my own for my expenses for the garrison lately. So home, by the way calling for my Chaucer and other books, and that is well done to my mind, which pleased me well. So to my office till late writing letters, and so home to my wife to supper and bed, where we have not lain together because of the heat of the weather a good while, but now against her going into the country.

28 Annotations

Pedro   Link to this

On this day James Duke of York writes to Sandwich (Carte Papers)

Written from: St James's Date: 9 July 1664

Shelfmark: MS. Carte 75, fol(s). 193

Instructions for the conduct of the Fleet "now bound forth to the Sea". They contain the usual directions for celebration of Divine Service, according to the Liturgy of the Church of England; for the watchful survey of the Enemy's Coast, and for the avoidance of all acts of hostility against any of the King's Allies, unless there be a failure in any customary acknowledgment of his Majesty's sovereignty of the Seas.

(The exact letter is added as an apendix in Sandwich's Journal by Anderson. A few added points...When fully provided with 4 months supplies to take the first opportunity to sail from the Downs. From time to time to send what was needed to observe the coast of Holland for intelligence. To hold courts martial for punishing offenders, and give frequent notice of all occurrences which may concern his Majesty's service.)

jeannine   Link to this

Meanwhile Lord Sandwich has received his instructions from the Duke of York today.....

"Journal of the Earl of Sandwich" edited by R.C. Anderson (Appendix IV)

SANDWICH'S INSTRUCTIONS FOR 1664
(Carte MSS. Vol 75, f. 193)

James, Duke of York and Albany, Earl of Ulster, Lord High Admiral of England and Ireland, etc. Constable of Dover Castle, Lord Warden of Cinque Ports and Governor of Portsmouth, etc.

To Edward Earl of Sandwich my Lieutenant and Admiral and Captain General of the Narrow Seas, and Admiral of his Majesty's Fleet, now bound forth to the sea.

So soon as his Majesty's ships (now in the Hope) shall be fully provided of their victuals and stores for four months, you are to order them to take the first opportunity of sailing into the Downs, where you are to take upon you the charge and command not only of the said ships, but likewise of such other of his Majesty's ships as you shall find there, or shall hereafter be sent thither for his Majesty's service, within his Majesty's seas.

You are to take care that Almighty God be duly served on board the ship under your command twice every day by the whole ship's company, according to the Liturgy of the Church of England, and that blasphemy, drunkenness, swearing and profaneness be discountenanced, restrained and punished.

You are from time to time to send out such of his Majesty's ships or vessels under your command as you shall judge fit, toward the coast of Holland, or to any other parts where you shall understand the Dutch fleet or any considerable part thereof shall be, to the end you may by that means have frequent and certain information of their number, strength and motion.

You are to instruct the commanders of such ships or vessels as you shall so send forth, and all others, that they do not attempt any hostility against any of his Majesty's Allies, unless they shall refuse or neglect to strike sail unto his Majesty's ships, or to do such other things as are customarily done in acknowledgement of his Majesty's right and Sovereignty of the Sea.

You are upon all occasions to take care that his Majesty's hounour be preserved, and his subjects protected and defended.

You are to take care to preserve good order and discipline in his Majesty's fleet under your command, and to that end (as occasion shall require) you are to put in execution the Articles of War established by Act of Parliament, and to hold Courts Martial for punishing offenders, according to the Commission particularly granted to you on that behalf.

You are to give me frequent notice of all occurrences which may any way concern his Majesty's service, to the end you may receive such further orders as may conduce to the good of his Majesty's service.

Given under my hand at St. James's this ninth day of July 1664.

James.

By command of his R: Highness
W. Coventry

(Endorsed by Sandwich) July 9, 1664. His Royal Highness. Instructions upon my first going to sea this summer.

Patricia   Link to this

"where we have not lain together because of the heat of the weather a good while"
I guess nothing would compel them to dispense with their nightgowns so that they could sleep together more comfortably? Probably not.

Terry F   Link to this

"but now against her going into the country."

Is it agreed that this means tonight they *are* sleeping together?

cape henry   Link to this

That's how I understood it, TF.

Todd Bernhardt   Link to this

"because we would not be obliged to attend the business when we can, but when we list."

What meaning does "list" have here? "when we can"?

"This consideration did displease me, but it was voted and so went."

You gotta love committees...

Cumsalisgrano   Link to this

"list" as in when we get a notice i.e. listed to attend to make the require quorum, just a thought.

Terry F   Link to this

"The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth...." John 3:8 (KJV)

Just so inscrutable will be the attendance of the members of the Fishery Commission.

Cumsalisgrano   Link to this

List :

15 entries for list: 5 verbs. 8 nouns and 1 adverb.
[a. F. liste = Sp., Pg., It. lista; prob. identical with LIST n.3, the special sense being developed from that of 'strip' (of paper): see LIST n.3 4.]

a. A catalogue or roll consisting of a row or series of names, figures, words, or the like. In early use, esp. a catalogue of the names of persons engaged in the same duties or connected with the same object; spec. a catalogue of the soldiers of an army or of a particular arm; also in phr. in or within the list(s, in list (occas. fig.).
active list, a list of those officers in the army or navy who are liable to be called upon for active service. free list, (a) a list of persons who are allowed free admission to a place of entertainment; (b) a list of articles which are exempt from duty under the revenue laws. Also army list, CIVIL LIST, retired list, sick list, etc. (see the first words).
In specific senses: (a) the titles of the books (to be) published by a particular publisher. So autumn list, BACKLIST, spring list. (b) an official register of buildings of architectural or historical importance that are statutorily protected from demolition or major alteration. Cf. LIST v.4 1e. (c) In the National Health

Paul Chapin   Link to this

"when we list" = whenever we choose to
OED: b. Without dependent inf.: To wish, desire, like, choose. (Chiefly in subordinate clauses)

c1200 Vices & Virtues (1888) 13 After ðan ðe here herte leste, ic hem folŠede. c1320 R. Brunne Medit. 352 Þy wyl be ydo, ryŠt as þou lest. 1430-40 Lydg. Bochas viii. v. (1558) 4 All worldly thynges chaungyng as she lust. a1450 Knt. de la Tour (1868) 3 To that entent that who so luste may kepe hem from harme. c1470 Henry Wallace v. 123 Deyme as yhe lest, ye that best can and may. 1535 Coverdale Ps. lxxii. 7 They do euen what they lyst. 1563 Homilies ii. Agst. Idolatry ii. (1859) 209 The Bishop of Rome+did in all the West Church+what he lust. a1586 Sidney Arcadia ii. (1629) 199 Your griefes, and desires whatsoeuer and whensoeuer you list, he will consider of. Ibid. iii. 260 He might returne if he listed. 1611 Bible John iii. 8 The winde bloweth where it listeth. 1616 R. C. Times' Whistle iv. 1441 Thou mayst make sale of it to whom thou list. 1674 Playford Skill Mus. i. 60 By his Musick he could drive men into what Affections he listed. 1741 Richardson Pamela (1824) I. xxvii. 42 Let them think what they list. 1823 Scott Peveril v, We will, if your ladyship lists, leave him. 1869 Freeman Norm. Conq. (1876) III. xiv. 348 The invaders landed and harried where they listed.

Cumsalisgrano   Link to this

Amongst some other uses: from OED, many have died out, other wise known as unlisted in the modern format of life

The flank (of pork); a long piece cut from the gammon.

1. Hearing; the sense of hearing. to have or give a list: to give ear, be attentive, keep silence.

2. The ear. (But cf. LIST n.3 1b.)

no 2: Art, craft, cunning. Also phr. by or with list.

no 3 : I. Border, edging, strip.

1. a. gen. A border, hem, bordering strip. Obs.

b. Applied to the lobe of the ear. Obs. [Cf. G. ohrleiste, which, however, means the 'helix' of the ear; also LIST n.1 2.] 1530

2. a. spec. The selvage, border, or edge of a cloth, usually of different material from the body of the cloth. Phrase, within the lists (usual in statements of measurement). [So F. liste in Cotgr.]

b. fig. and proverbial.

c. In generalized use: Such selvages collectively; the material of which the selvage of cloth consists.

d. attrib. (quasi-adj.) = Made of list.

1661 Inuentarye in MS. Rawl. A. 182 lf. 311 On rugg,

2 Liste couerlids [etc.].

3. a. A strip of cloth or other fabric.

b. Formerly often: A strip of cloth used for filtering or for causing a liquid to drip. Obs. 1593

4. a. A band or strip of any material; a line or band conspicuously marked on a surface. ? Obs.

b. Used for: A mark of a wound, a scar. Obs. rare1. c1489

. Arch. a. (See quot. 1812-16.) Obs. b. A small square moulding or ring encircling the foot of a column, between the torus below and the shaft above. (Cf. LISTEL.)
Cf. obs. F. liste, 'a small square out-iutting brow, or member of a piller' (Cotgr.). 1663

7. In various technical senses. a. (See quot. 1688.)
b. Carpentry. (? U.S.) 'The upper rail of a railing' (Knight Dict. Mech. 1875).

c. Carpentry. A strip cut from the edge of a plank. (Cf. LIST v.3 3).
d. Tin-plating. The wire of tin left on the under edge of a tinned plate, which is removed by plunging the plate into the list-pot. 1688
II. Boundary.

8. a. A limit, bound, boundary. Often pl. Obs.

1389

b. transf. and fig. A place or scene of combat or contest. Phr. to enter (the) lists.
.
a. sing. and pl. An encircling palisade; a railed or staked enclosure.
b. pl. The starting-place of a race (= L. carceres). Also sing. a racecourse or exercising ground for horses. Obs.

1581

1. Pleasure, joy, delight. Obs. c1205

3. (One's) desire or wish; (one's) good pleasure. Phrase at (one's) list. Now only arch.

1. Naut. The careening or inclination of a ship to one side.

1633 T. JAMES Voy. 82 The Ship at low water had a great lust to the offing.

1658 PHILLIPS, Lust of a ship.

Cumsalisgrano   Link to this

"... but when we list..." we have not got spliced yet, nor leaning to port or drinking of same.

Terry F   Link to this

Paul, I believe you have it exactly. So Pepys has writ in distress, that the Committee have decided "we are the least able to serve the Company, because we would not be obliged to attend the business when we can, but when we list."

Robert Gertz   Link to this

Once more onto the Brampton breech, dear Bess, once more...

Given her last summer with dear ole John and Meg, either it's stifling in London and any relief is acceptable or...I wonder where Captain Ferrers will be this August.

Meanwhile...

"It's summer bachelor-time, it's summer bachelor-time..." Sam, humming. "Mrs. Lane and Bagwell, too...I say how-de-do to you. Lets hope the playbill's good...With actresses we do what we would. 'Cause it's summer bachelor-time...And I am in me prime..."

"Sam'l? What are you humming there?"

"Humming, dear?"

"Sam'l..." narrow look. "I'm thinkin' it's not such a good idea me going to Brampton this summer. You having been so ill and all and you know how things went with your father last year."

Blink...Ummn...

"Mrs. Pepys. I do assure you I'm quite well these days and you, my poor, poor wretch must think of your own fragile health. The plague, Bess...We must consider the plague. Death could stalk the city in these vaporous, reeking days at any time."

Hmmn... "I've heard of no plague in town as yet."

"Even more important, dearest." Conspiratorial tone... "One of us must make sure Brampton is being well managed. Bess, you know my father...And my poor mother...God knows how they may be running the place into the ground. Our retirement home...And I can't possibly leave myself just now, war and all."

Hmmn...Retirement home. "Well..."

"There's my girl...Well, off I go."

It's summer bachelor-time...It's summer bachelor-time.

("You were a goosey girl to think or pretend to think I didn't want you here because you know I do..." Franklin Roosevelt to Eleanor, she enroute with children to Campobello, Maine, 1917. Eleanor, it wasn't you...Pity you couldn't have read this and several other Diary entries. As to why some of us through the centuries risk hurting the spouses and s.o.s we love for a little fun...?)

Michael Robinson   Link to this

...but when we list. This consideration did displease me,

We know that SP has demonstrated expertise in construtruing and parsing the texts of solemn oaths sufficient to render them of minimal inconvenience, so the loophole must make this oath utterly meaningless.

Michael Robinson   Link to this

Committees for Fishing ... Guinny ... Tangier

The management team just changing deck-chairs on the Titanic?

GrahamT   Link to this

Patricia:
Early in the diary Pepys talks of going to his naked bed. It was said then that night clothes were only worn in winter and the mode of the time was to sleep naked.
See Wheatley's annotations to http://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/1660/05/21/

andy   Link to this

but now against her going into the country.

Male priority in eveidence here:

a) Lie with the wife
b) then send her away to the country.

Robert Gertz   Link to this

"...blasphemy, drunkenness, swearing and profaneness be discountenanced, restrained and punished."

Good luck, my Lord.

One can almost see Coventry smiling faintly to himself as he writes this up.

"Goddamn it!" Sandwich throws the instructions to the deck. "Howe, more rum!" shakes mug. "Aye, my lord." "Bloody bastards, do they think I have time whilst pursuing the f-ing Dutch to waste holding services and curbing 'blasphemy, drunkenness, swearing and profaneness...'? By the Mass, damn them all to Hell! Howe, you write to Pepys and tell him to tell that damned fool Coventry that his Grace's instructions aren't worth a Goddamn bloody...."

jeannine   Link to this

"blasphemy, drunkenness, swearing and profaneness"

Gee Robert, when I read this I thought these were exactly the reasons why men actually went on these boats..go out and have some wild times! God knows they won't get paid by Charles II!

Or ... perhaps this line came from the job description of "close personal friend of Charles II" (aka Buckingham, Rochester, etc. may fit this bill....)

Robert Gertz   Link to this

"What's this, what's this, Sir John?" Sir Will Batten eyes the document Minnes is chortling a bit over...

Here...Minnes hands over. "The fleet instructions from His Grace." Smile, tapping the most interesting section.

"Lets see...'...blasphemy, drunkenness, swearing and profaneness be discountenanced, restrained and punished.' Good God, I can't even 'restrain' my Lady Batten on such. How the hell do they expect a fleet commander to manage it?"

"Like to see Charles try it on Castlemaine..." Minnes grins. "But Miss Pepys will no doubt adore it."

Bob T   Link to this

I guess nothing would compel them to dispense with their nightgowns so that they could sleep together more comfortably? Probably not
Why are you assuming that they wore nightgowns even in hot weather Patricia? Sam and Elizabeth lived in the seventeenth century, but they thought as we do. Religous views perhaps? Religion has not stopped most ordinary people doing what they want in private yet. They would dump the bedclothes and nightshirts as readily as we would. Of course, going to the coolness of their basement was out of the question, and we have seen from previous entries in the diary

Dan Jenkins   Link to this

I do recollect reading a description of gowns which the Church promulgated as to be used during intercourse, so as to minimize the licentiousness of the act. Such prudery might well have influenced the Puritans. Even in those days, I can imagine this was honored more in the breach than in the observance.

In the current era of Charles, well, anything goes, including nightclothes.

Bradford   Link to this

L&M Companion, "Dress: Men's Dress," 100:

"Nightwear consisted of a nightshirt worn with or without underwear. The old habit of wearing no nightclothes (of going to one's 'naked bed') seems to have been no longer so common."

Robert Gertz   Link to this

Meanwhile, at Brampton...

"Is there nothing to be done Johnny?"

"Nothing for it, Meg. Sam confirmed it in today's letter. She is coming."

"Damn. I thought for sure that bad meat we served the Montagu girls would keep her off."

"Aye..." John sighs. "But there's no help for it. Jennings, Merrivale, Molly, Sally." he addresses the line of servants in livery. "I'm afraid we'll need to lodge you for a bit in the village again. I'm sorry."

"Not a problem, sir." Jennings nods.

"But first of course we must get this place cleaned out. Pall, Molly, Sally...You take the Rembrandts from the parlor. Meg and I will get the silver in the dining room hidden. Jennings, you get the cart and...Carefully, man...Take the Michelangelo to town with you."

"Yes, Mr. Pepys. Yes, Father." chorus.

"Fortunately this summer most of my gold is secure with my bankers in Paris." John notes. "And the rest is safely buried in the cellar. Now Meg, Pall...You know I hate to do this but you must store your silks."

"Anything to keep her and Sam from ferreting us out, John." Meg, calmly. "Aye, Father." Pall nods, but sighs... "Must I send my gallant colonel off?"

"Tis for the greater good, girl." John, solemnly. "You know what Sam's like and what he'd do if learned of me fortune from my Holland trips."

"Every penny under his hands in a week..." Meg frowns.

"Well, we've done enough for our boy, I'd say. Though I'd not hesitate to help him if he was in need."

"In need..." Pall, scornfully... "And all he sends you, knowing no better...A lousy 10Ls."

Damn and Colonel Bratton was ready to propose, I know it.

Cumsalisgrano   Link to this

Dressing for bed: going to thy resting place requires help of the upper maid and the required grooming. Showing of 'wot' we be calling a 'TV neck line' was normal but showing thy naval to all and sundry be a little more risque, 'tis why the wealthier or betters had bedsheets hanging from the rails, only then the "oh! wow":
Only in the stifling heat do we get to see the female stifle.

Cumsalisgrano   Link to this

thanks Paul missed that:
OED: b. Without dependent inf.: To wish, desire, like, choose.
should have read all the verbs :

Patricia   Link to this

Thanks, Graham T, when I read that portion of the Diary I was rushing to catch up with the dailies and missed a lot of the nuances, through not having time to read all the annotations that help call attention to these things.
Pepys is so anxious about having on enough clothing in the daytime, I wrongly assumed this anxiety would carry over into the nighttime. Well, if they're naked and still too hot to sleep together, it must be hot indeed!

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