Tuesday 16 August 1664

Wakened about two o’clock this morning with the noise of thunder, which lasted for an houre, with such continued lightnings, not flashes, but flames, that all the sky and ayre was light; and that for a great while, not a minute’s space between new flames all the time; such a thing as I never did see, nor could have believed had ever been in nature. And being put into a great sweat with it, could not sleep till all was over. And that accompanied with such a storm of rain as I never heard in my life. I expected to find my house in the morning overflowed with the rain breaking in, and that much hurt must needs have been done in the city with this lightning; but I find not one drop of rain in my house, nor any newes of hurt done. But it seems it has been here and all up and down the countrie hereabouts the like tempest, Sir W. Batten saying much of the greatness thereof at Epsum. Up and all the morning at the office. At noon busy at the ‘Change about one business or other, and thence home to dinner, and so to my office all the afternoon very busy, and so to supper anon, and then to my office again a while, collecting observations out of Dr. Power’s booke of Microscopes, and so home to bed, very stormy weather to-night for winde. This day we had newes that my Lady Pen is landed and coming hither, so that I hope the family will be in better order and more neate than it hath been.

22 Annotations

Terry F   Link to this

John Creed to Sandwich

Written from: [London]
Date: 16 August 1664

Shelfmark: MS. Carte 75, fol(s). 208-209
Document type: Holograph

Has taken opinion of counsel in the matter of the wool-laden ship seized at Dover. Is advised that a writ of appraisement should be obtained from the Court of Exchequer.

Adds that advice has come through the English Ambassador in Spain of the arrival of Colonel Fitzgerald at Tangier. http://www.bodley.ox.ac.uk/dept/scwmss/projects...

This, I take it, follows on last 13th Saturday's post by Jeannine: "Journal of the Earl of Sandwich" edited by R.C. Anderson

13th. Saturday. This morning Rich. Mathews and the master and others concerned in the wool ship were cited and accordingly went to Dover....

http://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/1664/08/13/#c17...

Glyn   Link to this

And just one month to go to second Pepys meet-up as mentioned here:

http://www.pepysdiary.com/about/archive/2007/06...

Book your plane or train ticket now. Also during that weekend is the Thames Festival with a fireworks display on the river and illuminated night carnival:

http://www.thamesfestival.org/

as well as London Open House weekend (see link).

OK, OK, back to the Diary.

MissAnn   Link to this

Glyn - once again the Lotto folk have let me down and I cannot make it to the Old Dart for the meet-up, maybe next year. Hope you all enjoy yourselves, please take & make photos available for those of us across the seas who are with you in thought only.

Paul Chapin   Link to this

Glyn, thank you very much for organizing this. I have in fact bought my ticket and booked my room, and am looking forward very much to the event. I write here in hopes of encouraging many other Pepysians to be there, as it would be wonderful to be able to put faces and personae to your handles.

Robert Gertz   Link to this

The fall of New Amsterdam is only ten days away on August 27 (jumping to fast approaching midnight). I wonder if the Duke's recent burst of temper is related to concern over the more or less secret operation, not to mention the increasingly dire reports as to De Ruyter's movements against Guinea.

Robert Gertz   Link to this

I suppose the modern equivalent of this coming war would be trying to secure the methane of Titan and the water of Europa while protecting your colonies on Mars. Quite a handful for the fleets of the day on both sides and with the communication problems it would not be hard to imagine the Duke and co on edge, unable to intervene in any way for weeks should things go wrong.

It's interesting that Sam seems so shut out of any inner workings on strategy. I don't expect the Duke to consult him on war plans but I'd expect he'd have access to well-placed people passing more direct info to him and that Batten and Penn might drop some interesting bits. So far he seems reduced to gleaning only the barest outlines. Even if strategy is confined to the King's immediate circle there must be a number of captains, dock officers, adminstrators along the chain of command, even common seamen, who know or have picked up quite a bit.

Pedro   Link to this

John Creed to Sandwich (Terry)

Has taken opinion of counsel in the matter of the wool-laden ship seized at Dover. Is advised that a writ of appraisement should be obtained from the Court of Exchequer.

I think this refers to the entry posted by Jeannine...

"Journal of the Earl of Sandwich" edited by R.C. Anderson

6th August... Capt. Nixon in the Elizabeth sent in a pink laden with wool from Ireland that was going for Holland on the back of the Goodwin.

http://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/1664/08/06/#ann...

Pedro   Link to this

Sorry Terry I meant also to add an entry that Jeannine had not posted

10TH August...

Captain Pett came into the Downs in the Henrietta yacht, and Mr Wickendon and Mr Mason of Dover came on board and examined the Dutchman of the wool ship upon oath.

Pedro   Link to this

Sorry Jeannine one more reference...

11th August, Richard Mathews went aboard the wool ship and siezed her for the King and with chalk made the broad arrow upon her mast.

Xjy   Link to this

"It's interesting that Sam seems so shut out of any inner workings on strategy. I don't expect the Duke to consult him on war plans but I'd expect he'd have access to well-placed people passing more direct info to him and that Batten and Penn might drop some interesting bits. So far he seems reduced to gleaning only the barest outlines. Even if strategy is confined to the King's immediate circle there must be a number of captains, dock officers, adminstrators along the chain of command, even common seamen, who know or have picked up quite a bit."

Robert G makes a good point here. I think it indicates very clearly that Sam is not a strategist at all. Not by training and not by inclination. He's an operationalist, a helper, a nuts-and-bolts man. Not a policies man, but an administrator of policies decided by others. Hence his nervousness at the quality of his relations to policy people - a good civil servant needs to be entrusted with operating the policies.

Sam's genius is for high-level understanding of the needs of administration. His attention to the details that make a policy operable (if you can call the quality of timber, masts, ropes and sails "details" in relation to the navy of the day), and his insistence on smoothly working chains of command etc (people doing what they should and being where they're supposed to be) show this.

It´s the famous difference between policies honcho Mao, and administrative honcho Chou En Lai, where the relationship was paradigmatic, and led to a solid and lasting leadership team. Whereas the non-paradigmatic, tense, unclear relationships in this respect between Lenin, Stalin and Trotsky show how convulsive for a regime/leadership the results of such conflicts could be.

Now if only Sandwich had been king and Pepys his right-hand man (say Prime Minister)... :-)

As for Cromwell and the Commonwealth, imagine if Milton, say, had had Pepys's administrative gifts...

Bradford   Link to this

Is Pepys describing sheet lightning?

Robert Gertz   Link to this

"It´s the famous difference between policies honcho Mao, and administrative honcho Chou En Lai, where the relationship was paradigmatic, and led to a solid and lasting leadership team. Whereas the non-paradigmatic, tense, unclear relationships in this respect between Lenin, Stalin and Trotsky show how convulsive for a regime/leadership the results of such conflicts could be.

Now if only Sandwich had been king and Pepys his right-hand man (say Prime Minister)... :-)"

Or perhaps...Molotov to Sandwich's Stalin?

***

"As for Cromwell and the Commonwealth, imagine if Milton, say, had had Pepys's administrative gifts..."

Dang, now you've done it. I'm picturing an alternate universe where Cromwell avoided illness and Sam as the rising, ambitious, newly appointed assistant to poor, doomed...Diary-spitewise as well as career... Milton.

"Mr. Milton like a doting fool, waxing on about his poetry, and as much use to this office as..."

Of course the vows would have had that extra ring of state-sponsored religious enthusiasm. A bit more political freedom, perhaps the Rota would've continued...But no plays, darn.

bitter o salt   Link to this

re: 10 days prior to landing to finding land fall of tLange Eyelandt alias Matouwacs nuf Jorck Shire , before finding the Manhattans and its little village of Nieuw Amsterdm op t_ Eyeant Manhattans, a place consisting of a windmill [de wintmolen ], a church [Kerck] and a flag, all lifted from a map available [1655] by Visscher.

I find it strange that Long Island was named Jorck Shire. The Duke of York seeing this name on the secret map, obviously had to capture it and correct the spelling.

Cumsalisgrano   Link to this

Studying this map, it appears to have been updated by 70 years, by naming an area Penn syvania, there by it can be very confusing.

Michael Robinson   Link to this

Jansson, 'Belgii Novi,...' 1651

CSG: Below is a link to an image of the edition of 1651; apparently twenty seven editions were produced, in Holland, England and Germany, the end of the C 17th. (The cartouche view in yours, lower right, is the celebrated image of New York which appears first in the editions issued by Visscher circa 1655, and later)

http://maps.bpl.org/id/10055/

For a discussion of the NY view and its proposed original:-
http://web.archive.org/web/20000816185818/www.m...

For an un-sourced Dutch gouache view of New York, circa 1664:-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:GezichtOpNie...

Robert Gertz   Link to this

One wonders if Operation York hadn't been carried out...And New Amsterdam remained Dutch, right in the middle of the Atlantic seaboard dividing the British colonial empire in America. With French and Indian support in the 1750s, could have made for quite an interesting situation.

Then again if Stilicho hadn't pulled the damned legions off the Rhine in 406...

bitter o salt   Link to this

Far superior version, thanks Mr Robinson. Now I can find the Tappans and Sinsin without the later updates. This could be the version that they were using to sneak up on the Windmill.

Michael Robinson   Link to this

Visscher 'Belgii Novi,... multis in locis emendata ...' 1655

Below is a link to the first issue of the Visscher re-engraving, which corrected the Jansson edition of 1651, and includes the first appearance of the engraved view of New Amsterdam.

http://maps.bpl.org/id/10056/

Michael Robinson   Link to this

Colom 'Pas caarte van Nieu Nederlandt' ca 1656

Not useful for sneaking up on the Windmill, but as the best sea chart of the time probably used for at least the latter part the passage of Nicholls small fleet from Portsmouth, on May 15th., to Boston on July 23rd.

Michael Robinson   Link to this

Omitted Link: http://maps.bpl.org/id/M8718/

elizabeth acton   Link to this

Can anyone tell me where the saying "The old dart" meaning London comes from and what does it mean.
Thank you
E Acton

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