Doesn't anyone think Sam might have been using hyperbole when he said they ate the pig hand to fist? Don't we all exaggerate in that manner, especially when it comes to greedily eating and drinking? "We devoured the meal. "He gobbled it up." "We made pigs of ourselves." "He inhaled the food." "She drank like a fish." "He drank his companions under the table." Would anyone take these words and phrases literally? Do you all think Sam was always deadly serious, never making light of anything, even in informal conversation? No joking, no kidding around, no exaggerating for effect, even in the "privacy" of his diary?
"did walk an hour or two..." The L&M edition confirms that 'walk' is the correct reading.
"Interesting. Still, an hour or two? Indeed a very big house, or may be they had a gym at home?"
I expect they went back and forth or round and round over the same area many times.
As for Sam's discourse with Mr. Moore, Sam often gets hopelessly lost in a sea of pronouns--as do I in reading it. Without spending more time than I have, trying to make head or tail of the story, I usually move on, having come to no conclusion as to what Sam was going on about. I chalk up losing the plot occasionally to the fun of reading Pepys!
Jeannine: "it seems almost a miracle that so many babies and mothers actually survived."
Not many did survive. The reason there were enough babies to continue the population was because there were so mamy conceived in those days of no effective birth control. A loss of 36% before the age of six would hardly be noticed, demographically speaking.
"Demographers estimate that approximately 2% of all live births in England at this time (17th century) would die in the first day of life. By the end of the first week, a cumulative total of 5% would die. Another 3 or 4% would die within the month. A total of 12 or 13% would die within their first year. With the hazards of infancy behind them, the death rate for children slowed but continued to occur. A cumulative total of 36% of children died before the age of six, and another 24% between the ages of seven and sixteen. In all, of 100 live births, 60 would die before the age of 16." http://amechanicalart.blogspot.co…
Many young mothers died, too, and women of childbearing age. It's easy to think that it would have taken a miracle for the population to survive.
Thanks for the information about "brave" especially how it's used in everyday speech in Northern Ireland. I had never heard the word used like that before.
Robert Harneis. No, it wasn't only upper class men who treated lower class women--and children--as their sexual gift from god. Poor women and children had to contend with men of their own class as well, with no defenses. The reason I mentioned upper class men is that Pepys was one and acted no better than any of them. He mentioned "gallants". Not sure what that meant in Pepys' time but I assumed it was upper class men, "gentlemen"' if you will, since they had footmen. I don't know of any lower class men who had footmen. The point is that poor women and children of the time never had a chance. They were horribly treated by men of their own class as well as those above and they had no defense against either. They were victims of men of all classes from the day they were born until the day they died, unless they got old, sick, crippled and ugly. Then maybe they got some relief, but even that is not a sure thing. Men of all classes in general have been wonderful human beings throughout history, haven't they? Pepys' scurrilous attitude toward women and children has never been out of fashion, even today.
"So homeward, and called at my little milliner’s, where I chatted with her, her husband out of the way, and a mad merry slut she is. "
Looks like he's over his profound disappointment at not being able to join in the gang rape of the girl selling ribbons and gloves that he had his eye on. How comforting is that?
What a time to be a woman of no means! She sells ribbons intead of her body and she gets raped, since all women are fair game, especially poor ones, and she has no defense whatsoever. I would bet that no "gentlemen" were ever charged. I can just see one of these "gentlemen" who would immediately get 10 of his friends to swear she was a whore in the unlikely event they were ever charged. Who ever heard of moralty or compassion from men when it came to poor women? End of case. These women were doubly or triply injured because of they got pregnant, and many did, they were ostracized even more. So many had no way to raise a child and many a babe and the mother withered and died on the streets. The gallants and their footmen, and Pepys himself, knowing that poor women were put on earth by god himself just for the use of men of a higher rank, (the women having no rights at all), would probably step over their bodies, even kicking them into the gutter while they were at it. It would be another 75 years before London got its first foundling hospital where babies could be dropped off by desperately poor women, many of whom had been raped or just abandoned. It was a toss up what happened to the babies. Like their mothers, they, too were expendable, if not considered complete trash. Nice.
Thanks so much to San Diego Sarah for that detailed and interesting information, and to Stan B for the story about burning tally sticks. Linda, the first place I ever heard about a counting house was in the nursery rhyme, too. I might have heard reference to it later in novels, biographies and Masterpiece Theater, without really knowing what a counting house looked like or how it functioned. I pictured a table piled with gold coins and a seated figure, perhaps the king himself, counting them out, one by one.
When did personal bank accounts as we know them become available in England? Anyone know? I hadn't thought about where people kept their money in those days until I read today's entry. So many things we take for granted today that would be alien to Pepys et al. And what about people with really large sums of money and assets, such as the king? I suppose he might have had a counting house and people to look after the contents.
When did personal bank accounts as we know them become available in England? Anyone know? I hadn't thought about where people kept their money in those days until I read today's entry. So many things we take for gramted today that would be alien to Pepys et al. And what about people with really large sums of money and assets, such as the king? I suppose he might have had a counting house and people to look after the contents.
The men on this blog should know that a razor strop does not sharpen a razor, it only sets the edge.
I asked a barber I know if he shaves himself with a straight razor. He said, " No, they're too dangerous."
I wonder if they had anything like a styptic pencil in Sam's time. Probably not.
In early America and for some decades after, I hear they used old corncobs as toilet paper. I don't think they would help with razor cuts. Sam probably used a rag.
I like Paul Chapin's reference to his inner atheist. Very astute.
Bradford: "read a lecture to my wife upon the globes": does this suggest to anyone else that he has a book, from which he is reading extracts aloud, which provides information about foreign lands or heavenly bodies, rather than discoursing out of his own knowledge?
Couldn't he have done both? Using his own knowledge and gleaning more information from books, then writing it up in terms he thought Elizabeth would understand? Isn't that what pedagogues have done for millennia and do to this day? "See here, my dear . . ."
This is odd. The Wikipedia entry on James Turner [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/J…] who I assume is the same James Turner Pepys is referring to--unless there was anothet similar James Turner of the same time. But the Wikipedia article says, he "appears to have died soon after 1685, although the exact date of his death is unknown." It says nothing about an execution. 1685 is long after Pepys says he witnessed his hanging in 1664. Can anyone straighten this out? Am I barking up the wrong tree?
Even if laundry was done only once a month or once every six months in the Pepys household, I'll bet underclothes and bed linen were washed every time whether they needed washing or not.
Comments
Second Reading
About Friday 12 February 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
Lampreys are like overgrown leeches. Both are parasites. Yummy.
About Friday 12 February 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
Lampreys are like overgrown leeches. Both are parasites. Yummy.
About Lamprey
Louise Hudson • Link
So they're a lot like overgrown leeches. Parasites. Yummy!
About Thursday 11 February 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
Doesn't anyone think Sam might have been using hyperbole when he said they ate the pig hand to fist? Don't we all exaggerate in that manner, especially when it comes to greedily eating and drinking? "We devoured the meal. "He gobbled it up." "We made pigs of ourselves." "He inhaled the food." "She drank like a fish." "He drank his companions under the table." Would anyone take these words and phrases literally? Do you all think Sam was always deadly serious, never making light of anything, even in informal conversation? No joking, no kidding around, no exaggerating for effect, even in the "privacy" of his diary?
About Tuesday 9 February 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
Rueben: Ruben on 10 Feb 2007 • Link • Flag
"did walk an hour or two..."
The L&M edition confirms that 'walk' is the correct reading.
"Interesting.
Still, an hour or two? Indeed a very big house, or may be they had a gym at home?"
I expect they went back and forth or round and round over the same area many times.
As for Sam's discourse with Mr. Moore, Sam often gets hopelessly lost in a sea of pronouns--as do I in reading it. Without spending more time than I have, trying to make head or tail of the story, I usually move on, having come to no conclusion as to what Sam was going on about. I chalk up losing the plot occasionally to the fun of reading Pepys!
About Saturday 6 February 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
Jeannine: "it seems almost a miracle that so many babies and mothers actually survived."
Not many did survive. The reason there were enough babies to continue the population was because there were so mamy conceived in those days of no effective birth control. A loss of 36% before the age of six would hardly be noticed, demographically speaking.
"Demographers estimate that approximately 2% of all live births in England at this time (17th century) would die in the first day of life. By the end of the first week, a cumulative total of 5% would die. Another 3 or 4% would die within the month. A total of 12 or 13% would die within their first year. With the hazards of infancy behind them, the death rate for children slowed but continued to occur. A cumulative total of 36% of children died before the age of six, and another 24% between the ages of seven and sixteen. In all, of 100 live births, 60 would die before the age of 16."
http://amechanicalart.blogspot.co…
Many young mothers died, too, and women of childbearing age. It's easy to think that it would have taken a miracle for the population to survive.
About Friday 5 February 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
Thanks for the information about "brave" especially how it's used in everyday speech in Northern Ireland. I had never heard the word used like that before.
About Wednesday 3 February 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
Robert Harneis. No, it wasn't only upper class men who treated lower class women--and children--as their sexual gift from god. Poor women and children had to contend with men of their own class as well, with no defenses. The reason I mentioned upper class men is that Pepys was one and acted no better than any of them. He mentioned "gallants". Not sure what that meant in Pepys' time but I assumed it was upper class men, "gentlemen"' if you will, since they had footmen. I don't know of any lower class men who had footmen. The point is that poor women and children of the time never had a chance. They were horribly treated by men of their own class as well as those above and they had no defense against either. They were victims of men of all classes from the day they were born until the day they died, unless they got old, sick, crippled and ugly. Then maybe they got some relief, but even that is not a sure thing. Men of all classes in general have been wonderful human beings throughout history, haven't they? Pepys' scurrilous attitude toward women and children has never been out of fashion, even today.
About Thursday 4 February 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
"So homeward, and called at my little milliner’s, where I chatted with her, her husband out of the way, and a mad merry slut she is. "
Looks like he's over his profound disappointment at not being able to join in the gang rape of the girl selling ribbons and gloves that he had his eye on. How comforting is that?
About Wednesday 3 February 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
What a time to be a woman of no means! She sells ribbons intead of her body and she gets raped, since all women are fair game, especially poor ones, and she has no defense whatsoever. I would bet that no "gentlemen" were ever charged. I can just see one of these "gentlemen" who would immediately get 10 of his friends to swear she was a whore in the unlikely event they were ever charged. Who ever heard of moralty or compassion from men when it came to poor women? End of case. These women were doubly or triply injured because of they got pregnant, and many did, they were ostracized even more. So many had no way to raise a child and many a babe and the mother withered and died on the streets. The gallants and their footmen, and Pepys himself, knowing that poor women were put on earth by god himself just for the use of men of a higher rank, (the women having no rights at all), would probably step over their bodies, even kicking them into the gutter while they were at it. It would be another 75 years before London got its first foundling hospital where babies could be dropped off by desperately poor women, many of whom had been raped or just abandoned. It was a toss up what happened to the babies. Like their mothers, they, too were expendable, if not considered complete trash. Nice.
About Sunday 31 January 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
Thanks so much to San Diego Sarah for that detailed and interesting information, and to Stan B for the story about burning tally sticks. Linda, the first place I ever heard about a counting house was in the nursery rhyme, too. I might have heard reference to it later in novels, biographies and Masterpiece Theater, without really knowing what a counting house looked like or how it functioned. I pictured a table piled with gold coins and a seated figure, perhaps the king himself, counting them out, one by one.
About Sunday 31 January 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
When did personal bank accounts as we know them become available in England? Anyone know? I hadn't thought about where people kept their money in those days until I read today's entry. So many things we take for granted today that would be alien to Pepys et al. And what about people with really large sums of money and assets, such as the king? I suppose he might have had a counting house and people to look after the contents.
About Sunday 31 January 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
When did personal bank accounts as we know them become available in England? Anyone know? I hadn't thought about where people kept their money in those days until I read today's entry. So many things we take for gramted today that would be alien to Pepys et al. And what about people with really large sums of money and assets, such as the king? I suppose he might have had a counting house and people to look after the contents.
About Friday 29 January 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
The men on this blog should know that a razor strop does not sharpen a razor, it only sets the edge.
I asked a barber I know if he shaves himself with a straight razor. He said, " No, they're too dangerous."
I wonder if they had anything like a styptic pencil in Sam's time. Probably not.
In early America and for some decades after, I hear they used old corncobs as toilet paper. I don't think they would help with razor cuts. Sam probably used a rag.
I like Paul Chapin's reference to his inner atheist. Very astute.
About Thursday 28 January 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
"being mightily troubled with my left eye all this evening from some dirt that is got into it."
Probably a bit of dirty jealousy in his eye.
About Thursday 21 January 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
Thanks, BL. It appears that Pepys' James Turner doesn't rate a Wikipedia article.
About Sunday 24 January 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
Bradford: "read a lecture to my wife upon the globes": does this suggest to anyone else that he has a book, from which he is reading extracts aloud, which provides information about foreign lands or heavenly bodies, rather than discoursing out of his own knowledge?
Couldn't he have done both? Using his own knowledge and gleaning more information from books, then writing it up in terms he thought Elizabeth would understand? Isn't that what pedagogues have done for millennia and do to this day? "See here, my dear . . ."
About Thursday 21 January 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
This is odd. The Wikipedia entry on James Turner [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/J…] who I assume is the same James Turner Pepys is referring to--unless there was anothet similar James Turner of the same time. But the Wikipedia article says, he "appears to have died soon after 1685, although the exact date of his death is unknown." It says nothing about an execution. 1685 is long after Pepys says he witnessed his hanging in 1664. Can anyone straighten this out? Am I barking up the wrong tree?
About Monday 18 January 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
There have been many Dutch classical composers, including a fair number of women. Here's a list.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/C…
And several,20th Century composers
No link. Google search for dutch composers 20th century
About Monday 11 January 1663/64
Louise Hudson • Link
Even if laundry was done only once a month or once every six months in the Pepys household, I'll bet underclothes and bed linen were washed every time whether they needed washing or not.