Monday 30 September 1661

This morning up by moon-shine, at 5 o’clock, to White Hall, to meet Mr. Moore at the Privy Seal, but he not being come as appointed, I went into King Street to the Red Lyon to drink my morning draft, and there I heard of a fray between the two Embassadors of Spain and France; and that, this day, being the day of the entrance of an Embassador from Sweden, they intended to fight for the precedence! Our King, I heard, ordered that no Englishman should meddle in the business,1 but let them do what they would. And to that end all the soldiers in the town were in arms all the day long, and some of the train-bands in the City; and a great bustle through the City all the day. Then I to the Privy Seal, and there Mr. Moore and a gentleman being come with him, we took coach (which was the business I come for) to Chelsy, to my Lord Privy Seal, and there got him to seal the business. Here I saw by day-light two very fine pictures in the gallery, that a little while ago I saw by night; and did also go all over the house, and found it to be the prettiest contrived house that ever I saw in my life. So to coach back again; and at White Hall light, and saw the soldiers and people running up and down the streets. So I went to the Spanish Embassador’s and the French, and there saw great preparations on both sides; but the French made the most noise and vaunted most, the other made no stir almost at all; so that I was afraid the other would have had too great a conquest over them.

Then to the Wardrobe, and dined there, end then abroad and in Cheapside hear that the Spanish hath got the best of it, and killed three of the French coach-horses and several men, and is gone through the City next to our King’s coach; at which, it is strange to see how all the City did rejoice. And indeed we do naturally all love the Spanish, and hate the French.

But I, as I am in all things curious, presently got to the water-side, and there took oars to Westminster Palace, thinking to have seen them come in thither with all the coaches, but they being come and returned, I ran after them with my boy after me through all the dirt and the streets full of people; till at last, at the Mewes, I saw the Spanish coach go, with fifty drawn swords at least to guard it, and our soldiers shouting for joy. And so I followed the coach, and then met it at York House, where the embassador lies; and there it went in with great state. So then I went to the French house, where I observe still, that there is no men in the world of a more insolent spirit where they do well, nor before they begin a matter, and more abject if they do miscarry, than these people are; for they all look like dead men, and not a word among them, but shake their heads.

The truth is, the Spaniards were not only observed to fight most desperately, but also they did outwitt them; first in lining their own harness with chains of iron that they could not be cut, then in setting their coach in the most advantageous place, and to appoint men to guard every one of their horses, and others for to guard the coach, and others the coachmen. And, above all, in setting upon the French horses and killing them, for by that means the French were not able to stir.

There were several men slain of the French, and one or two of the Spaniards, and one Englishman by a bullet. Which is very observable, the French were at least four to one in number, and had near 100 case of pistols among them, and the Spaniards had not one gun among them; which is for their honour for ever, and the others’ disgrace.

So, having been very much daubed with dirt, I got a coach, and home where I vexed my wife in telling of her this story, and pleading for the Spaniards against the French.

So ends this month; myself and family in good condition of health, but my head full of my Lord’s and my own and the office business; where we are now very busy about the business of sending forces to Tangier, and the fleet to my Lord of Sandwich, who is now at Lisbon to bring over the Queen, who do now keep a Court as Queen of England.

The business of Argier hath of late troubled me, because my Lord hath not done what he went for, though he did as much as any man in the world could have done.

The want of money puts all things, and above all things the Navy, out of order; and yet I do not see that the King takes care to bring in any money, but thinks of new designs to lay out money.

57 Annotations

First Reading

Pedro.  •  Link

"And indeed we do naturally all love the Spanish, and hate the French."

Being almost 350 years ago Sam will “remember Agincourt” even better than we do now!

Josh  •  Link

Does all this whoop-te-do mean anything more than fans and teams fighting during a sports match?

dirk  •  Link

Quite a lively day!

The fight between the Spanish and the French: something like a duel organized on a large scale - reminds me even of the mini wars the Romans occasionally staged in the Colosseum. Both parties seem to have been free in their respective choice of arms and number of fighting men (very much like in a war really): the French went for the guns, the Spanish for noble swordplay *and* superior though somewhat dirty tactics (killing the horses).

Naturally Elisabeth would be vexed to hear "her" side lost. And Sam, willingly or not, rubs it in.

All this shows how volatile public opinion is though: Pedro mentions Agincourt, but let's not forget the Spanish Armada business (much closer to Pepys' time than Agincourt).

dirk  •  Link

"This morning up by moon-shine"

Bright moon, for two days ago was full moon, with a partial eclipse (I wonder why Sam made no mention of that - or is his scientific interest waning?)

Source:
http://sunearth.gsfc.nasa.gov/ecl…

vicente  •  Link

Dirk: all's fair in Love and war "somewhat dirty tactics (killing the horses)."
? la guerre comme a la guerre. — “All’s fair in love and war.”
http://www.fact-index.com/l/li/li…
wot a day for the paper of the day

vicente  •  Link

so normal. "... and home where I vexed my wife in telling of her this story, and pleading for the Spaniards against the French..."

Stolzi  •  Link

"I vexed my wife"

With his pro-Spanish partisanship, or with running off like a small boy, aplashing through the mud, to see the fun, and coming home all "daubed"?

"Oh Samuel - !" (sigh of exasperation)

Australian Susan  •  Link

"Daubed"
Well, gues who was going to have to get all that mud off! And with no modern stain removers either.
Wonderful entry this, with Sam rushing about all fascinated and eagar for news - never mind the dirt - and the old idea of the French being the "real" enemy, which is so much a part of English popular culture: two instances of this - in Tony Richardson's Charge of the Light Brigade, he has the superannuated English commander of the troops keep referring to the enenmy as The French: his aide-de-camp has to keep whispering that it's the Russians, and the immortal Sir Humphery Appleby referring to the French as the Real Enemy in various episodes of yes Minister.

Snow  •  Link

Tintin, our intrepid reporter running through the streets following the action! Apart from Sam's personal interest in what's going on I get the feeling that he knows he's reporting it for future readers of the diary. I can imagine him relating this story to Elizabeth with all the actions. A thrilling entry.

Pedro.  •  Link

John Evelyn's account of the fray.

In his diary for the 1st October:
"then (the King) commanded to me draw-up the Matter of fact happning at the bloudy Encounter which then had newly happn'd betweene the French & Spanish Ambassador neere the Tower, at the reception of the Sweds Ambassador contending for precedency."

http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Le…
It is said that an account can be seen "in that gentleman’s article in the Biographia Britannica."
May be interesting if it could be found?

andy  •  Link

as I am in all things curious

It's this diligence in getting and recording the full story that's Pepys' hallmark; and on the other side of the text, the wry notes that reveal Sam's character.

Chrisreiki  •  Link

Oh, what a delight!

"And indeed we do naturally all love the Spanish, and hate the French"

It was ever thus.

Pedro.  •  Link

A CONTEST FOR PRECEDENCE

"the Spaniards had not one gun among them; which is for their honour for ever, and the others' disgrace"

Dirty tricks by the French.

"and fifty on horseback, most of the latter, in defiance of the arrangement made with the king, being armed with pistols and carabines."
http://www.thebookofdays.com/mont…

A. De Araujo  •  Link

"Our King, I heard ordered that no Englishman should meddle in the business"
Very clever;let them kill each other;after all isnt he suposed to impose law and order in his realm.

Stolzi  •  Link

A far more serious note
is the King's extravagance and fiscal irresponsibility -

"The want of money puts all things, and above all things the Navy, out of order; and yet I do not see that the King takes care to bring in any money, but thinks of new designs to lay out money."

Wim van der Meij  •  Link

Was this skirmish between the Spanish & the French a private war or some sort of tournement? Were the two countries at war at this time? It would be unthinkable these days to have this kind of thing; fancy the Spanish and the French ambassadors with their soldiers having a small battle in Hyde Park in October 2004!

Peter  •  Link

You see newspaper articles from time to time decrying the abuse of diplomatic immunity from crimes and misdemeanours ranging from traffic offences to murder. Imagine the the outraged headlines if this happened today!

helena murphy  •  Link

It is not just the prestige of Spain which is at stake but the might of the Hapsburg Empire,which controlled Spain,practically all of central and latin America ,as well as central and eastern Europe.The dispute is meant to indicate who has hegemony in Europe, the French or the House of Hapsburg,the latter losing ground to a strong,militaristic and united France under Lousi X1V.

Maurie Beck  •  Link

Oh, what a delight!

"And indeed we do naturally all love the Spanish, and hate the French"

It was ever thus.

And the French the English. “Eeengleesh, I fart een your general direcion!” Monty Python and the Holy Grail.

Maurie Beck  •  Link

It is not just the prestige of Spain which is at stake but the might of the Hapsburg Empire,which controlled Spain,practically all of central and latin America ,as well as central and eastern Europe.

Thanks for illuminating the geopolitics of the time.

Glyn  •  Link

Yesterday, he went to bed completely drunk, a few hours later he is on his way to work at 5 am. 20-year-olds have great recuperative powers.

I don't think the French particularly dislike the English, even jokingly. The Brits only have them (and the Irish) as neighbours, but the French have lots of other countries on their borders, so attitudes change.

Ranking-wise, at the time of the Diary the 2 major European countries are France (population almost as big as everyone else combined) and Spain (the most powerful). England is in the second or third rank.

Glyn  •  Link

And why is Elizabeth cheering on the French, when they drove her family out of the country, probably killing some of her family?

Ruben  •  Link

welcome back, Vicente

Robert Gertz  •  Link

"And why is Elizabeth cheering on the French, when they drove her family out of the country, probably killing some of her family?"

Interesting...And suggesting Beth may be of different opinions than her Protestant dad, Alexander. Pity he doesn't get on with Sam, it would be nice to hear what he and Balty think of this.

Not to mention I'd love to hear more about his perpetual motion machine and other toys. I have to suspect Sam was either once throughly humiliated (during the great pre-Diary row with Beth?) by the St. Michels or throughly convinced that Dad-in-law the inventor is a humbug for our boy not to show some interest.

Unless perhaps an embarrassed Bethie keeps Dad's tinkerings strictly secret.

Shame though, I'd love an entry...

"Up betimes and with Hooke and Mr. Evelyn to my father-in-law's where he did show me his machine of motion perpetual... Which indeed I was much with child to see."

JWB  •  Link

"prettiest contrived house"
This was the Danvers House, built by Sir John Danvers, the Regicide. It adjoined Thomas More's and was torn down to make way for Danvers Street in 1696.

Nix  •  Link

The struggle for precedence --

From the items Pedro and Glyn linked to, it appears that the French lost this battle but won the war: a year later the Spanish conceded diplomatic precedence to the French. I guess it was a point of pride -- does anyone know if there was any practical significance attached to "precedence"?

PHE  •  Link

Superb entry
which so well presents Sam's character. While he is the social climber who wishes to be dignified and sophisticated, he simply can't resist being the voyeur, wanting to rush back and forth and know everything that happens - but then taking the effort to record everything in vivid and journalistic detail.

Robert Gertz  •  Link

"So, having been very much daubed with dirt, I got a coach, and home where I vexed my wife in telling of her this story, and pleading for the Spaniards against the French. So ends this month; myself and family in good condition of health..."

Delightful close to a great tale...Just a touch of rueful guiltiness over hurting Bethie's feelings while a boy's impish glee at "vex[ing] my wife"...

Fun to see him conceding Beth the role of adult here...Though I'd bet she enjoyed his eagerness in telling the tale.

I'll commit a possible act of heresy here and further bet he did read the Diary to her at times...In carefully censored bits.

john lauer  •  Link

but the 1st 'precedence' link above works just fine...

Second Reading

Bill  •  Link

"they intended to fight for the precedence"

This had been a frequent source of contention, and many absurd incidents had occurred. In 1618, Gaspar Dauvet, Comte des Marets, Ambassador to James I., left our Court in dissatisfaction upon a point of precedence claimed by him over Gondomar, which was not allowed by James. The question now came to a crisis, and was settled.
---Diary and correspondence of Samuel Pepys, the diary deciphered by J. Smith. 1854.

Bill  •  Link

"There were several men slain of the French"

This fray was the occasion of a good joke at the French Court, thus related in the Menagiana, vol. ii., p. 336:—" Lorsqu'on demandoit, 'Que fait Batteville en Angleterre?' on repondoit, 'Il bat L'Estrade.'" This expression, as is well known, means "battre la campagne avec de la cavalerie pour avoir des nouvelles des ennemis."
---Diary and correspondence of Samuel Pepys, the diary deciphered by J. Smith. 1854.

I'm sure someone can explain this joke. The closest I can get for "battre l'estrade" is "to do military reconnaissance."

Bill  •  Link

"the French were at least four to one in number"

The French accounts swell the number of the Spanish Ambassador's attendants to 2000: 200 would, perhaps, be the truth.
---Diary and correspondence of Samuel Pepys, the diary deciphered by J. Smith. 1854.

Bill  •  Link

The joke: Though I see that BATtville is the Spanish ambassador and d'ESTRADES is the French ambassador and "battre" means "hit." haha

Bill  •  Link

Sept. 30 [1661] Happened that remarkable Encounter between the French Ambassador, and the Spanish, for Precedency at the publick Entry of Count Brohe, Ambassador Extraordinary from Sweden to England, on Tower Hill.
---A Chronological History of England. J. Pointer, 1714.

Gerald Berg  •  Link

Best ever!

"But I, as I am in all things curious,.."

I would surmise the chains brought out the guns. Very clever Spaniards...

Cara  •  Link

It's not just the English who have an uneasy relationship with the French, remember the, 'cheese eating surrender monkeys'

Annie B  •  Link

Wow! These last few days have been amazing. I just love the vision of our Sam racing all over the city to learn what happens, and just the day after he drank so much but knew not how. Reading through the website is my first time reading Sam, and it's becoming increasingly clear to me why he is so well-regarded. Thank you Sam!!

eileen d.  •  Link

from Wikipedia:
The term "cheese-eating surrender monkeys" first appeared in "'Round Springfield," an April 1995 episode of the American animated television show The Simpsons.[1] In the episode, budget cuts at Springfield Elementary School force the school's Scottish janitor, Groundskeeper Willie, to teach French. Expressing his disdain for the French people, he says to his French class in his Scottish accent: "Bonjoooouuurrr, ya cheese-eatin' surrender monkeys!"

Terry Foreman  •  Link

Journals of the Earl of Sandwich

30th. Monday. A Barnstable ship from Newfoundland came in to us once more was come in the day before.

This day I went to Lisbon to see the Huego de Toro [editor’s note: phonetic spelling of “juego de toro” — a bullfight] which was in a square place before the King’s palace, built on the 2 other sides with scaffolds 3 stories high hung with tapestry and carpets rich according to the quality of the noblemen and others to whom they belonged; a place railed in the middle to shelter footmen, and a tree scaffolded for trumpets. The beginning was a water cart, the men and horses and cart all trapped and covered with green tissue, came in to water the place and lay the dust. Then divers persons clad antiquely, some with guitars, other with drums and fiddles, dancing and tumbling in several sets and companies. Then there was an officer of the city mounted on a very good horse and rich saddle waited under the King’s window for his commands. He was attended by several, 10 or more with pied coats and 6 green coats with sharp forks and about 6 yellow coats. The pied coats, as soon as by the King’s command a bull was let out, struck him with darts and played at him to make him run at them and then escaped him by throwing off their cloaks on his horns. The men with forks likewise provoked him and when he ran at them then they exposed their forks to him at once and stopped his career. The yellow coats, when the bull was to be killed, went and seized on him, one first throwing himself between his horns and then the rest falling in and cutting his ham-strings; and then killed him. Presently whereupon there came in 6 horses all clothed and trapped with green tissue and the coachmen and postillion also and so seized a rope to the bull’s horns and galloped away with him out of the quadrangle.

After 3 or 4 bulls were tired and killed by the footmen then was another let out and the Conde de Sarzedas came in upon a fine well ranged horse very richly equipped, having 74 lackeys came in before the horse, half in red liveries with silver lace and half in green with silver lace. He marched up straight to the King’s window and there went up towards it and backed his horse astern 3 times to the King of Portugal and the like to the Queen of England. Then turned to seek out the bull on a grave pace, and when he ran at him he neglectly took a lance out of his footman’s hand and struck him between the horns upon the nape of his neck and broke his lance, and in like manner encountered every bull that came out, he going out 3 or 4 times to mount fresh horses very richly equipped. They killed in all 13 bulls that afternoon after one of the clock. When all was killed that ought to be, then the Conde went up again and made his respect to the King and the Queen as before and went away. Then the antiques danced again and so at sunset the company departed.
https://www.pepysdiary.com/indept…

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"a fray between the two Embassadors of Spain and France; and that, this day, being the day of the entrance of an Embassador from Sweden, they intended to fight for the precedence!"

The Great Powers were from time to time involved in such disputes, until in 1815 [Treaty of Paris] they adopted the rule that the order of precedence should be fixed at each capital according to the seniority (by appointment) or the ambassadors there. In this period it was based on the supposed seniority (by foundation) of the monarchies themselves. France and Spain contested for first place among the secular powers; their ambassadors had quarreled over it at The Hague in 1657. The dispute which Pepys reports occurred on the occasion of the state entry of the new Swedish ambassador, Brahe. He was to travel by water from Westminster to the Tower, where he would enter a coach provided by the King and, at the head of a procession, ride to the court. Later he would be given his first public audience. The French and Spanish ambassadors (d'Estrades and Vatteville) were both determined to get the place after the King's coach. Pepys's story is in part an eye-witness account, and because of the diplomatic disputes that followed, of special value. Pepys retained in his library Sir John Finett's Finetti Philoxenis (1656; PL 556), an account of similar disputes in England in the early 17th century. (L&M note)

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"prettiest contrived house"

The Danvers House was a substantial house of 36 hearths, at the s.-e. end of Danvers St, opposite Crosby Hall. Aubrey (c. 1691) wrote of iy: 'The house is very elegant and ingeniose but not according to that staid perfection of Roman architecture now in vogue' (qu. Davies, pp. 138-9). (L&M note)

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"So I went to the Spanish Embassador’s and the French"

York House and Exeter House, on the s. and n. sides of the Strand respectively. (L&M note)

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"hear that the Spanish hath got the best of it, and killed three of the French coach-horses and several men"

There had been a running fight from Tower Wharf to Crutched Friars; and according to the French ambassador, six Frenchmen had been killed and 33 wounded. (L&M note)

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"And indeed we do naturally all love the Spanish, and hate the French."

L&M explain: probably because the French were more commonly to be seen in London and were more serious competitors for jobs with the Londoners. D'Estrade's footmen had had a scuffle with watermen a few days before with some fatalities. In 1669 an Italian traveler remarked that Londoners were 'proud, arrogant and uncivil to foreigners...especially the French': Maglotti, pp. 396-7. (Per L&M note)

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"There were several men slain of the French, and one or two of the Spaniards, and one Englishman by a bullet. Which is very observable, the French were at least four to one in number"

L&M note Evelyn put the numbers at 150 Frenchmen and 40 Spaniards.

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"we are now very busy about the business of sending forces to Tangier"

By a council order of 20 September, 1000 foot soldiers and a troop of 100 horse were to be raised and transported. Agovernor (Peterborough) had just been appointed: see https://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/…

Carol D  •  Link

I've just come upon the diary of Henry Newcome, a non-conformist minister in Cheshire (in the north of England) and contemporary with Sam. This is from Newcome's diary entry of Thursday October 3rd 1661 (not sure if dates are synchronised with L&M version of Pepys): "In ye evening I went to Mr John Lightb [probably John Lightbourne, a lawyer] and yre wee heard yt yre had been a contest betw: ye followers of ye French and Spanish ambassadors at ye meetinge of ye Swedish ambassador, for the precedency, to ye losse of 8 men's lives, & wounding many others. Wt folly & pride rests in ye hearts of ye Sons of Men!"

News travels! We can of course understand that this incident would be much more immediate and exciting to London-based Sam. but clearly the scandal made nationwide news.

Terry Foreman  •  Link

Carol D, is this the fray of which you read?

30 September 1661
https://www.pepysdiary.com/diary/…
I heard of a fray between the two Embassadors of Spain and France; and that, this day, being the day of the entrance of an Embassador from Sweden, they intended to fight for the precedence!

San Diego Sarah  •  Link

Some background on the powers at play here:

At the Restoration, Charles II's instincts were to exercise a serious role in European affairs, and his new government was sensitive to unflattering comparisons with the influence which the Commonwealth and Protectorate had wielded abroad, plus the Restoration regime was a fragile one. Charles' desire to cut a figure abroad had to be tempered by an appreciation of the costs of international power politics and the threat it could pose to internal security.

Both France and Spain solicited an English alliance.

The Franco-Spanish War had been ended by the Treaty of the Pyrenees in 1659, but the politics of western Europe was still bound up with their continuing rivalry.

Plus the Spanish expected some dividends from the support they had given the exiled monarchy in the late 1650s, so in July 1660 Charles II formally ended the war with Spain which had been carried on fitfully since Cromwell's death.

Although Spain had advocates at the English court, it lacked the closeness that Charles II's family ties gave him to France, plus it could not overcome Charles’ enthusiasm for French society and government.

Even so, France's 1654 treaty with Cromwell, and Cardinal Mazarin's disrespect of royalist interests had chilled relations between the two courts, and not until the death of Cardinal Mazarin in March 1661 could relations officially recover.

But by then the Franco-Dutch Treaty was as good as signed, putting cousin Louis XIV reluctantly on the "other" side.

This spat today was therefore rather significant.

Carol D  •  Link

Hi Terry Foreman - yes, that's the event I was thinking of. So it took about 3 days for the news to get to Cheshire - or at least for Henry Newcome to hear about it.

(For non-Brits, Cheshire is a northern county about 200 miles north of London.)

Terry Foreman  •  Link

"Here I saw by day-light two very fine pictures in the gallery,"

L&M: Little is known of the pictures collected by Lord Robartes. His son, the 2nd Earl of Radnor (d. 1723), lived in a house in St James Park which contained pictures by artists popular in Pepys's time and later, such as Vanzoon, Roestraeten, Danckerts, Griffier, Van de Velde and Schalcken. It is not clear whether these painters had been employed by the first Earl or by his son; or which of them had collected the Italian and Flemish pictures included in the second Earl's sale, 28 April 172(?)3: G. Vertue, Notebooks, i. 132.

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